Anime problems with anime

[oshi]

I'm a big fan of animated works in general; I'll force myself to sit through things like Cinderella II or that stupid sumo wrestling show on Nick, just because I like the way their feet or their hair is drawn. But in anime, it's so much harder to stay interested because of the differences in value between American and Japanese animation. If you'll notice, even in untranslated shows, the mouths do not move to match the words coming out of them. And there is absolutely NO unnecessary movement. It's not realistic. The characters just stand there, and they usually talk for half an hour standing in basically the same position. Example: Ceres. It was a good story, but it was ruined in animation. I'm not saying that all animes suck, or that Japanese animation is worse or better than American--I can't get enough of the stuff! Escaflowne the movie was the best animated thing I've ever seen, but usually, the shows get kind of . . . repetitive.
oshi

[AzureWolf]

You did the what-what now? I have no idea what you said, but I'll try my best to make a rebuttal. :)

It sounds like you had a bad first experience with anime, and have now condemned them entirely. Going by one example is hardly fair. I could turn around and say, "What's up with American cartoons? So few details, and very inactive animation. Example? Fairly Odd Parents." Seriously, I think going by just a few anime series is not reason enough to make such a generalized statement about the diversity that is anime.

I'd recommend something from that wacky guy who made Princess Mononoke and Spirited Away. Watch one of those even, and I'm sure you'll appreciate the animation in anime. Heh, I, an avid fan of Bugs Bunny and Tom & Jerry, was floored by Princess Mononoke and Spirited Away's level of animation, so give anime one more chance.

[Anime Otaku]

She's right, different animes have different animation levels
some are better some are worse(but to tell the truth i never saw an american cartoon better the worst anime i ever saw ;))

[KharBevNor]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Anime Otaku [/i]
[B]She's right, different animes have different animation levels
some are better some are worse(but to tell the truth i never saw an american cartoon better the worst anime i ever saw ;)) [/B][/QUOTE]

True. let me guess, how old was the anime you saw? Older anime are both a lot more static and a lot worse dubbed than more recent anime (You [i]should[/i] be watching it subbed but I'll forgive you for that ;) ) Also, series area lot more static than films, becuase, lets face it, these people are working on a budget/ If you're a huge fan of great animation, any of the Studio Ghibli (spelling?) stuff is great, as well as stuff like Akira, Ghost in the Shell and Blood (Blood has a fantastically unsatisfying plot but the animation just blows me away) As far as well animated series goes, Cowboy bebop, Trigun and FLCL all have great animation, and you could never accuse them of being static...
Just please, please don't repeat the mistake of so many and judge all anime by one series.

[OtakuSennen]

[color=midnightblue]A little history on Japanese animation..

Osamu Tezuka is frequently considered the "God of anime". He created one of the very first manga, and set the "pointy-chinned, large eyed" style of anime that most people see when they think of anime.

Later on actual moving animations were made. Because of the poor economy of Japan after World War II, budgets for such things were rather sparse. Thus, to save money, frame rates were low and lip sync had to be cut short. This, too, stuck to the general style of anime.

Now let us look at anime today.

As with most if not all Japanese television, there is no such thing as a "season" with anime. Once a week all year long one episode is produced.

To keep this rapid rate of animation release going without running out of budget, animation [i]has[/i] to be rather low quality. That is also why a lot shows are only twenty-six or thirteen episodes long. The shorter series with a set amount of episodes and a full, thought-out script all know how to organize their budget. The longer-running series tend to have lower quality animation but have their script already laid out by the manga writer whose story the anime was based on. Let's not forget that we have some studios, such as Studio Pierrot in Japan, are making three or four episodes a week all year round.

With American cartoons you get maybe thirteen episodes a year for on average three years, and the rest of those fifty-two you sit there watching stale reruns and anticipating the next season. The stand-alone plotlines also get boring and repetitive, from what I've experienced.

I'm not saying that all American cartoons are bad, nor am I saying all Japanese cartoons are good. The Simpsons, Family Guy and Futurama, along with several others, are American cartoons that I love with all of my heart. And at the same time I totally dislike some series, such as Trigun (Boy, I'm gonna get flamed for that one).

You get either quality in story or quality in animation, and in the end what matters more: the humor and/or storyline, or how the characters' mouths move?[/color]

[Semjaza]

If you've not seen any US made animation that's better than the worst anime you've ever seen... then you've either never seen any US animation, you're comparing cheap to produce US children's cartoons to high-expense anime or you're simply blind.

If someone likes anime more or enjoy the style more, that's one thing. However, to make comments such as that is rather ignorant.

Do people realize that Japan has cookie cutter, utter crap animated series as well? It sure doesn't seem like it.

[Milo]

Okay, Oshi is a friend of mine and we've been watching many, many animes of different genres for along time. We watch mostly subbed, very rarely dubbed (subbed will always be better) anime.

I think what she means is that some animes don't have the detail that, say, Disney movies do. I mean, take a look at the expressions people make in Disney movies. Very realistic. (Add the fact that Oshi and I were just at Disney World... so cool!)

Some anime is amazing and freakishly well done. Some of it can get a little repetitive.

I think us anime-watching folk need more patience than people who watch un-subbed films. Rock on, us! (Is that why my eyes are so bad??) :drunk:

[oshi]

Okay, yeah, I think you're all making the assumption that I have just now finished watching the first anime I have ever laid eyes on, and that it was dubbed. No. No, that is not the case. I have seen probably OVER ONE HUNDRED shows and movies and read about SIXTY manga series, I prefer them to be subbed, I'm learning Japanese, I'm studying manga artistry; I know what I'm freakin' talking about! It's not that I think all anime is stupid, and don't for one second make the mistake in thinking that I adore American animation, too. Some of it IS crap. Total crap. But all I'm saying is, I find it irritating that movement is not very valued, and that in a lot of cases, you have to either give up a good plot for good animation, or vice versa. If you can't agree with that, I don't really think you HAVE seen much anime. That's how it's done sometimes! Not in all cases, of course, because saying that would be ignorant and easily proven wrong. Yes, Miyazaki's works are fantastic, but Pokemon . . . is not. Yes, Fantasia is amazing, but the Fairly Oddparents is not. If you want me to list every example I've ever seen, you would be daunted by the length of the post and would not read it. I used Ceres as an example because I've seen the entire series and it illustrates what I am trying to say perfectly: good story ruined by inactive animation. I thank OtakuSennen for that history; I get some things more now, but in my personal opinion, some Japanese animation could be a little more animated.
oshi

[Semjaza]

Well, I personally didn't make that assumption lol. We were on the same page it seems. People like comparing Japanese animated [i]films[/i] to random, inexpensive Saturday morning animation.

Japanese animation in general cuts a lot of corners. Frame skips, entire scenes with nearly no animation, background shortcuts (I've seen countless anime where the background in a scene is static, despite there being crowds of people in it for example). I assume mostly to keep costs down.

Again, I think a lot of the people who complain about Western animation just are making poor comparisons. At least use comparable shows so it remains fair. They usually prefer Japanese styles as well. There are a couple posts in here claiming that basically all US animation is worse than all Japanese animation... and they really have nothing to back them up other than personal preference.

Japan has countless poorly animated shows and such. The thing is, most people watch the same standard anime, so it's not even an issue. If we got all the stuff Japan did, I doubt people would feel that way. They'd have a more well-rounded idea of what anime has to offer.

[SasukeUchiha]

I think anime is an aquired taste. Anime is not supposed to be aout moving and action. Is it supposed to revolve around the writing and characters. If youw atch any tenchi Muyo movie, almost 1/4 of it is just shots of buildings and nature. Personally i just appreciate the beauty of these shots. And how anime can still completely take me in despite the fact that it isnt all based on action. I do not know if any of this makes sense I am basically typing exactly what im thinking lol. I hope I got my point across.

[Fujimiya]

As a typical obsessive anime fan, this is probably what one will expect. However, I do recognize the fact that anime has problems, even aside from the technicalities. I'll point out one within the short duration of this reply. Look at the animals in anime (not the chibi ones). Take Princess Mononoke and Lion King, and juxtapose the animals next to each other. Epiphemy: wow...the Japanese can not draw animals. Anime as a form of art is FAR from perfect, what appeals to me is the eh...how should I put this...the ideals of physical perfection. Gotta love the bishou-persons. :tasty:

[oshi]

I agree. Despite its imperfections, I love it anyway, and can't stop watching it. There are movies and shows done by Japanese and American animators working together that are absolutely amazing, because they blend the styles and reach a happy medium. If any of my stories ever become TV-worthy, that's what I would like to see happen to them.
I still think, however, that what's on TV, especially if the point of it is to be animated, it should BE ANIMATED. If not, manga will work just fine for me. I understand the need to work on storyline and character development, but how much better would it be if every aspect was attended to?
oshi

[Dagger]

Actually, many of the newer anime series and OAVs sport some pretty impressive animation. Only Last Exile's animation might truly be classified as cinema-quality, but other recent shows--such as RahXephon--are nevertheless far more attractive and dynamic than older works.

OAVs in general tend to be very well animated. For example, take Read or Die, a three-episode OAV. It's a little short on plot, but it manages to incorporate a decent amount of character development, and its action sequences are pure eye candy. This title is definitely worth owning, if only for its quirky, visually enthralling fight scenes.

~Dagger~