Gaming Official Otaku SSBB League

[MoonlightNexus]

[quote name='Desbreko'][color=#4B0082]From my experience playing the game for around fifteen hours now, I'd say smash balls shouldn't be allowed in serious competitive play. Some characters get a big advantage with their final smash while others have pretty crappy ones and it can really throw off what would otherwise be a balanced match. Some characters also have a lot easier time breaking the smash balls due to the types of attacks they have.[/color][/QUOTE]

That's a very good point. Some can be one-hit KO's, while others (like Jigglypuff and Peach) don't provide much of an advantage, and even others (like Sonic) can KO the person using it. And yeah, my brother was playing as Lucario (who gets stronger as he gets more damage), and he ended up getting the Smash Ball 9 times out of 10. Thanks for mentioning this, it's exactly the kind of thing that needs discussion.

[nabgeta]

[quote name='MoonlightNexus']That's a very good point. Some can be one-hit KO's, while others (like Jigglypuff and Peach) don't provide much of an advantage, and even others (like Sonic) can KO the person using it. And yeah, my brother was playing as Lucario (who gets stronger as he gets more damage), and he ended up getting the Smash Ball 9 times out of 10. Thanks for mentioning this, it's exactly the kind of thing that needs discussion.[/QUOTE] ok with the ruleing out of smash balls what about other items that can be one sided like assist trophies and poke'balls that can decide a match depending on who you get example if it's 1-1 and someone gets Lyn the other person is basically dead

[Desbreko]

[color=#4B0082]Pretty much every Smash tournament everywhere has items disabled entirely due to the random advantages they provide. If you want to attract serious players I'd suggest doing the same.[/color]

[Allamorph]

[quote name='Desbreko][color=#4B0082']From my experience playing the game for around fifteen hours now, I'd say smash balls shouldn't be allowed in serious competitive play. Some characters get a big advantage with their final smash while others have pretty crappy ones and it can really throw off what would otherwise be a balanced match. Some characters also have a lot easier time breaking the smash balls due to the types of attacks they have.[/color][/quote]
[FONT=Arial]I fail to see why the Smash Ball would be considered for inclusion. I mean, it is an item, and so it automatically alters the skill required to win.

With that said, everyone's final smash can be nasty if the player knows how to use it, and every one can be avoided if the player knows what they're doing. Jigglypuff's, for example, will KO a player near her at the apex of her growth. Obviously, then, one wants to edgehog with it if one can, and keep the other players off of firm ground.

The StarFox crew's smashes are similar, but Fox's has greater firepower, Falco's has greater flight time, and Wolf's has greater knockback on rolls. These are also avoidable, but a skilled player will know how to use mathematics to hit opponents in odd locations. Also, the Landmasters can die off the bottom of the screen. (I haven't felt like testing the limits on either side yet. =P)

Link's (and Toon Link's) final only targets one person, but others may be caught in the destruction if they're close enough, though they won't be trapped by the Triforce. Ike's needs to hit one player, but his range is long; Marth's final will stop as soon as it hits the first victim or he crashes off the side. In each case, multiple people may be caught if close enough, but dodging should be very easy, as all these finals are linear in initiation.

Triple Finish will only hurt if the player is on the shown screen, although Charizard's final burst of fire goes a little farther than the rest. Peach, along with Pit and all other characters with multiple jumps, should fare well against it, as will anyone who gets behind the pokémon.

Lucario can only Kamehameha in one direction, so that tactic should be Divide and Conquer. Sonic and Pikachu are nasty, but if one can time the dodges right, they'll be useless.

I could go on, but I think you get the point. I don't think they provide any one character with a clear advantage, just interesting ideas to play with.

And I think R.O.B. is broken. Seriously. No one should be able to jump off Final Destination and regain the stage on the other side by [I]going under it[/I] and still be able to attack immediately.[/FONT]

[MoonlightNexus]

[quote name='Allamorph'][FONT=Arial]I fail to see why the Smash Ball would be considered for inclusion. I mean, it is an item, and so it automatically alters the skill required to win.

With that said, everyone's final smash can be nasty if the player knows how to use it, and every one can be avoided if the player knows what they're doing. Jigglypuff's, for example, will KO a player near her at the apex of her growth. Obviously, then, one wants to edgehog with it if one can, and keep the other players off of firm ground.

The StarFox crew's smashes are similar, but Fox's has greater firepower, Falco's has greater flight time, and Wolf's has greater knockback on rolls. These are also avoidable, but a skilled player will know how to use mathematics to hit opponents in odd locations. Also, the Landmasters can die off the bottom of the screen. (I haven't felt like testing the limits on either side yet. =P)

Link's (and Toon Link's) final only targets one person, but others may be caught in the destruction if they're close enough, though they won't be trapped by the Triforce. Ike's needs to hit one player, but his range is long; Marth's final will stop as soon as it hits the first victim or he crashes off the side. In each case, multiple people may be caught if close enough, but dodging should be very easy, as all these finals are linear in initiation.

Triple Finish will only hurt if the player is on the shown screen, although Charizard's final burst of fire goes a little farther than the rest. Peach, along with Pit and all other characters with multiple jumps, should fare well against it, as will anyone who gets behind the pokémon.

Lucario can only Kamehameha in one direction, so that tactic should be Divide and Conquer. Sonic and Pikachu are nasty, but if one can time the dodges right, they'll be useless.

I could go on, but I think you get the point. I don't think they provide any one character with a clear advantage, just interesting ideas to play with.

And I think R.O.B. is broken. Seriously. No one should be able to jump off Final Destination and regain the stage on the other side by [I]going under it[/I] and still be able to attack immediately.[/FONT][/QUOTE]

Wow, that's pretty in-depth! Thanks for the commentary, I appreciate you taking the time to write all of that.

The reason I have been considering adding the Smash Ball is that, while it is an item, I think it's such a [I]different[/I] item than everything else. It gives the player an ultimate attack, which is still a part of a character's unique repertoire. I was thinking about Street Fighter-type games, where special attacks are normal and frequently used.

Like you mentioned, Final Smashes can be avoided, so the user has to have a certain amount of skill in pulling them off. Some assist trophies will keep attacking you, so you're pretty much certain to get seriously damaged or KO'd. Also, items like the baseball bat are one-hit KO's, which is totally unfair. I thought this uncertainty involved with Final Smashes made them more "fair play" than other items. Another thing I was balancing was how much Final Smashes could turn the tide of a match. On one hand, they could make a match more competitive by evening-out the stock count, but on the other hand this could seem as an unfair advantage. Someone who is clearly dominating the match shouldn't suffer because of a Final Smash.

Thanks to the responses in this thread, I'm strongly leaning to not include the Smash Ball in official League matches. All things considered, they do seem to provide an unfair advantage, and while they do require some skill to use, it's not as much skill as just fighting would take. Besides, matches can be just as exciting without Final Smashes!

[nabgeta]

[quote name='MoonlightNexus']Wow, that's pretty in-depth! Thanks for the commentary, I appreciate you taking the time to write all of that.

The reason I have been considering adding the Smash Ball is that, while it is an item, I think it's such a [I]different[/I] item than everything else. It gives the player an ultimate attack, which is still a part of a character's unique repertoire. I was thinking about Street Fighter-type games, where special attacks are normal and frequently used.

Like you mentioned, Final Smashes can be avoided, so the user has to have a certain amount of skill in pulling them off. Some assist trophies will keep attacking you, so you're pretty much certain to get seriously damaged or KO'd. Also, items like the baseball bat are one-hit KO's, which is totally unfair. I thought this uncertainty involved with Final Smashes made them more "fair play" than other items. Another thing I was balancing was how much Final Smashes could turn the tide of a match. On one hand, they could make a match more competitive by evening-out the stock count, but on the other hand this could seem as an unfair advantage. Someone who is clearly dominating the match shouldn't suffer because of a Final Smash.

Thanks to the responses in this thread, I'm strongly leaning to not include the Smash Ball in official League matches. All things considered, they do seem to provide an unfair advantage, and while they do require some skill to use, it's not as much skill as just fighting would take. Besides, matches can be just as exciting without Final Smashes![/QUOTE]

well then it's agreed that items and smash balls will not be used in tournament play but maybe we can use them in seasons just have the item drop very low

[PyrusDragon]

Agreed. I sometimes have been in complete control of a match then lost it due to a Final Smash. Keeping items appearnace low in regular season play is a good idea as well.

[MoonlightNexus]

I've addressed the use of items over on the OCL World. Thanks for your input, I took a lot of it into consideration. I like the idea of having a low item drop rate during seasons (except for the Hammer, Golden Hammer, and Invincibility Star), with NO items during playoffs. This is still a work-in-progress, and the rules about items could change after awhile.

A big thing I want to talk about is stages. I really don't want to use stages where different stage factors can influence the outcome (like the Ultimate Chimera in New Pork City). Two obvious ones to use are Battlefield and Final Destination.

What are some of your ideas? Would something like Sonic's stage (where portions can fall apart) be "fair." Or even Pit's stage for that matter. Any scrolling stages are pretty much out, unless a strong arguement is made to include them.

Bring on the comments!

[nabgeta]

[quote name='MoonlightNexus']I've addressed the use of items over on the OCL World. Thanks for your input, I took a lot of it into consideration. I like the idea of having a low item drop rate during seasons (except for the Hammer, Golden Hammer, and Invincibility Star), with NO items during playoffs. This is still a work-in-progress, and the rules about items could change after awhile.

A big thing I want to talk about is stages. I really don't want to use stages where different stage factors can influence the outcome (like the Ultimate Chimera in New Pork City). Two obvious ones to use are Battlefield and Final Destination.

What are some of your ideas? Would something like Sonic's stage (where portions can fall apart) be "fair." Or even Pit's stage for that matter. Any scrolling stages are pretty much out, unless a strong arguement is made to include them.

Bring on the comments![/QUOTE]

well I find the Ultimate Chimera very easy to aviod and I never seen a human player get caught by it either....as for other stages I have no problem with them but, the new Ice climber stage could be taken out because of the fish (it is funny to see people get eaten :o) other than that no real problem with stages

[PyrusDragon]

The fish angers me and I think Spear Pillar might wanna be taken out as well. (You never know what Palkia and Dialga might come up with.) But other then that I'm fine with every stage on the game. I agree with nabgeta that the Ultimate Chimera is really easy to avoid.

[MoonlightNexus]

That blasted fish + a somewhat inconvenient camera angle = ANGER!!! That fish has gotten me more than once...

Spear Pillar is definitely out, but you guys bring up a great point about the Ultimate Chimera. It's like Shadow Moses, where the spotlight can easily be shaken off.

So, EVERY stage except Spear Pillar and the scrolling stages? And maybe the Metroid stage where you fight for the "safehouse" to avoid lava (can't think of the name right now...)?

[PyrusDragon]

You're thinking of Norfair. Yeah I didn't think of that one. Also, I'm finally getting WiFi at my house (via LAN adapter) but I'm not sure when. Unfortunatly, I won't be able to access it during the weekdays.

[Haku877]

Hmmm, this sounds interesting. Ill check this out, also if anyone if looking for matches just P.M me with your code and ill get you mine.

[PyrusDragon]

Ha ha, I forgot to put up my FC for everyone. btw, I read the world page and I [I]SHOULD[/I] be clear for Saturday.

My FC: 3179-6021-4429

[MoonlightNexus]

I just over some MAJOR internet issues (for example, not even being able to get on the internet, which is sort of an issue). However, I spent time on it, even talked to someone in India (named Sarah...go figure...), so I'm ready to go again!

It's time to cut all the junk and get this thing started! Everyone who wishes to participate needs to send me the following info:

1) Best time available to play
2) Top 3 characters you use
3) Favorite stage
4) Brawl Friend Code

Why am I asking for your favorite stage? Because I'm brewing up something sneaky. I'll let you know more later, but one tip I'll give you is to pick your ABSOLUTE FAVORITE state, because it's going to make a difference!

[MoonlightNexus]

Haven't gotten a lot of replies back yet for the info...

I already have the first match set up, but I need everyone else's info to set up the rest!

[Haku877]

well I should probably get my info in for this.

1.Anythime after like 6, But I can go whenever.
2.Pit, Lucas, Olimar.
3.Bridge of Eldin.
4. 3566-1199-7349