kaekara

Manga
What do you look for in a manga's story?

28 posts in this topic

Do you prefer a manga that is a bunch of comedy and makes you laugh all the time? Or do you like a manga that makes you sit on the edge of your seat that is jam packed full of action? Or maybe you like a manga that is full of drama and sadness? Or maybe there are some other things you like when reading a manga?

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[quote name='kaekara']Do you prefer a manga that is a bunch of comedy and makes you laugh all the time? Or do you like a manga that makes you sit on the edge of your seat that is jam packed full of action? Or maybe you like a manga that is full of drama and sadness? Or maybe there are some other things you like when reading a manga?[/quote]
Well, I would have to say.......edge of my seat and jam packed full of action. :catgirl:

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[COLOR=DarkOrange]I like any genre so long as it's portrayed well. At this point, when I've read enough that just about any basic plot somes across as totally cliche, the most important thing is the characters. Deep characters who actually progress and learn and are easy to connect with are rare, but the stories they are in benefit greatly from them. Sometimes there are stories that are genuinely unique and engrossing -- Death Note being a major candidate as one of them.

For me, I personally have a great appreciation for psychological thrillers. Anything boogiepop will immediately be mine, especially lol. As far as this category goes, though, there are much more anime than manga which fall itno this category.

Another thing is being able to take a story that is not unfamiliar and make it the best in the genre. King of Bandits Jing, with absolutely fascinating artwork and a strange and utter cool that immerses you in the story, is a beautiful example of this.

Then, as i said before, there are stories where the characters just draw you in. Boogiepop once more comes to mind, even f it is a novel -- Nodame Cantabile I have not yet read the manga but the anime is a direct adaption so i think i can be sure in saying that it's a great choice. Megatokyo, though echnically and American story told in the fashion of a Japanese comic, is another fine example.[/COLOR]

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[B]1. A Non-Typical Plot:[/B] I'm getting sick of "harem" and "magical girl" manga, but if you can pull the plot off without making it terribly generic, I will probably be interested. Two examples of "magical girl" manga I really like are [I]Cardcaptor Sakura[/I] (the art and humor are great), and [I]Tokyo Mew Mew[/I], which is a cute manga with an ecological edge (every main female character is based on a specific endangered creature, and the graphic novel features biographies on these animals and how to save them).

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[B]2. Likable Characters:[/B] One example of a manga character I love is Chii from [I]Chobits[/I]. Although she was a robot, she had very human qualities, such as clumsiness and love, and her childlike character made me want a Persocom myself! On the other hand, if you can really hate a character you know is fake, or if a manga makes you shed honest tears, you know they've done really well.

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[B]3. Great Art:[/B] Which explains why I'm a sucker for CLAMP. I love their artwork enough to have drawn fanart, made forum signatures, and stared at it for hours on end, and I still can't get enough, that's how much I love it.

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[color=#9933ff][size=1]I too will say that I love manga that's either [i]not[/i] cliche, or if it is, it approaches and does the cliche in a new, interesting way.

I don't really like manga like Naruto or BeetJuice (is that what it's called? Whatever it was, it reminded me of Naruto). I'm not especially interested in Bleach. The funny thing is, I do watch Naruto and Bleach as anime, but I'm just not interested in the manga.

Whistle! is a sports manga that I really love. (And even though my friend has like... every volume of Prince of Tennis, she's never lent them to me. I swear, she must be possessive of those volumes.) However, the sports genre is, generally, off my radar. I'm not a big fan of Crimson Hero (volleyball, ShojoBeat mana), and I've never picked up Hikaru no Go (I'm going to classify it as a sport since they DO compete).

I have really weird taste in manga. My favorite is xxxHolic, by CLAMP. It's really, really fun, too, if you've read other CLAMP works, because there are a lot of allusions to their other stuff in xxxHolic.

I've noticed that I'm particularly attracted to humorous manga. Or manga of different genres, with humor thrown in. Kill Me Kiss Me (manhwa, whatever) is completely hysterical, Saiyuki is not only bloody and gorey but also hilarious, and DNAngel is sweetly romantic... and funny! Even xxxHolic is pretty funny, Watanuki especially.

Hmm... I also read yaoi (BL, really) manga, all though those tend to be angsty or dramatic for some reason. Exceptions to the rule, weird! O_o;

But yeah, I'm going to say that mostly, I like humor.[/size][/color]

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I look for depth in mangas. If there's no depth in a manga, what's the point of reading it? Over publicitized mangas aren't very good (in my opinion) either. I also don't like random points of nonsense (except in AzuManga Daioh! by Kihohiko Azuma)
I do like the fantasy stories that have a realistic feel to them, like they could really happen! I do like humor in manga and also at least a little action. Honestly mangas such as Full Moon O Sagashite and Rozen Maiden are ones that I thouroughly enjoy because of the realistic fantasy in them.

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[QUOTE=MistressRoxie][color=#9933ff][size=1]I too will say that I love manga that's either [i]not[/i] cliche, or if it is, it approaches and does the cliche in a new, interesting way.

I don't really like manga like Naruto or BeetJuice (is that what it's called? Whatever it was, it reminded me of Naruto). I'm not especially interested in Bleach. The funny thing is, I do watch Naruto and Bleach as anime, but I'm just not interested in the manga.

Whistle! is a sports manga that I really love. (And even though my friend has like... every volume of Prince of Tennis, she's never lent them to me. I swear, she must be possessive of those volumes.) However, the sports genre is, generally, off my radar. I'm not a big fan of Crimson Hero (volleyball, ShojoBeat mana), and I've never picked up Hikaru no Go (I'm going to classify it as a sport since they DO compete).

I have really weird taste in manga. My favorite is xxxHolic, by CLAMP. It's really, really fun, too, if you've read other CLAMP works, because there are a lot of allusions to their other stuff in xxxHolic.

I've noticed that I'm particularly attracted to humorous manga. Or manga of different genres, with humor thrown in. Kill Me Kiss Me (manhwa, whatever) is completely hysterical, Saiyuki is not only bloody and gorey but also hilarious, and DNAngel is sweetly romantic... and funny! Even xxxHolic is pretty funny, Watanuki especially.

Hmm... I also read yaoi (BL, really) manga, all though those tend to be angsty or dramatic for some reason. Exceptions to the rule, weird! O_o;

But yeah, I'm going to say that mostly, I like humor.[/size][/color][/QUOTE]

[COLOR=DarkOrange]If you think reading CLAMP manga like XxXHolic or reading DNAgel makes you unique and crazy, you are sadly extrmely mistaken and need to spend more time on the internet. Believe me, if it's being released in America, it's more than likely pretty popular, and if it's got the CLAMP STAMP then you can bet everyone and their grandma has read it, lol.

Not to say these aren't good series or anything XxX Holic is entertaining if I do say so, but I'd never go so far as to say that it superceeds cliche.[/COLOR]

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[COLOR=Magenta]Personally, I love to read manga that is entertaining and has either comedy or action. I love action for the suspense that I want to keep reading until the end and I love comdey. I mean who doesn't. It's hilarious to read something that they do or what. I think that's it's funny. I have a taste for romance and how relationships work out. I'm attracted to manga that have a cool summary and a good collection of books. I like manga that have their unique way of standing out to me and say "Look at me. I'm interesting!"

Manga can have many effects if I want to read them or not and that's just my opinion. My sister has a different one but we still share them to see if they are exciting or not.[/COLOR]

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[QUOTE=2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange]If you think reading CLAMP manga like XxXHolic or reading DNAgel makes you unique and crazy, you are sadly extrmely mistaken and need to spend more time on the internet. Believe me, if it's being released in America, it's more than likely pretty popular, and if it's got the CLAMP STAMP then you can bet everyone and their grandma has read it, lol.

Not to say these aren't good series or anything XxX Holic is entertaining if I do say so, but I'd never go so far as to say that it superceeds cliche.[/COLOR][/QUOTE][color=#9933ff][size=1]My question for you, is who do you think you are? First of all, what gives you the right to address [i]anyone[/i], including me so rudely? And second of all, don't you dare put words in my mouth.

Where, in my post, did I use the words "unique" and "crazy?" Use the firefox find feature and it won't find those words because I never said anything that you implied. Next time, THINK before you decide to make false accusations.

The word I DID use was "weird," referring to the subject material that I read. I consider the events in xxxHolic pretty strange because of the spirits involved, the people who bring bad luck ([spoiler]Himawari-chan[/spoiler]), those who keep spirits away ([spoiler]Domeki-kun[/spoiler]), the whole concept of who Maru and Moro are. I consider DNAngel "weird" because how many manga do you know of where a boy turns into his "other half" when he sees the girl he likes, and that his other half is a master thief. That's not weird?

I also fail to understand why xxxHolic does not go beyond the "cliche." What cliche are we talking about? Just because it's made by CLAMP does *NOT* automatically categorize it as cliche, you do realize. I'm aware of a few other manga, yes, that do involve a shop that grants wishes (i.e. Yume Kira Dream Shoppe), but in that case, the two manga are [i]incomparable[/i] on a thematic level. Yuuko has such wise knowledge and (to Watanuki, infuriating) vices that make her so much "darker" than Rin. Additionally, by their very nature, Maru and Moro are darker than Alpha (all are assistants).

It also takes more than a couple manga of similar concept to constitute a cliche, but even if somehow, oddly enough, xxxHolic did quality, I did say I liked manga that bent the cliche, which I think I've proven xxxholic DOES.

On DNAngel, don't even try to pretend it's cliche. It's not. The romance has nothing to do with it being remotely cliche. Find me another manga with the same storyline and I'll consider debating it with you.


Frankly, I have not had anyone on Otakuboards say something so discourteous and condescending to me in years. All though there is more that I would like to say to you, I hope I have gotten my point across well enough.[/size][/color]

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[quote]Or maybe there are some other things you like when reading a manga?[/quote]
[font=comic sans ms]Naughty, naughty :)

In any case, I only read one type of manga and it's the action types. I think they're called shonen...? "shrugs" Like anime, I haven't read much. I don't ever feel up to buying them or I've been too impatient to wait for anything to download. (anything that's really long anyway.)

So far the only manga's I've read / am currently reading are Bleach, Naruto, Tenjho Tenge (too long to wait for downloading) and Rurouni Kenshin. Everyone once in a while I may browse through Hellsing and Samurai Deeper Kyo.

So, like my animes, I only look for action.[/font]

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[COLOR=DarkOrange]DNAngel is VERY cliche. It is made up of four general plotpoints. 1.) a romance story, but you said it has nothing to do with it, so I'll leave that out. 2.) A kid who tranforms into an older guy, which has been done before (if you want, I could go find some examples) 3.) the whole 'master theif' thing, which I think was pulled off terribly since the heists are probably the most boring part of the story. and 4.) a love triangle/square/pantagon/whatever shape you feel describes it. I can't see anything unique about it.

XxX Holic is actually pretty cool -- mind you by calling it cliche, I'm not insulting it, beacuse I think it does what it does very well, and I find it very enjoyable. The biggest part of the cliche is probably in the characters, who aren't original at all, but that's okay because they do well in the surrounding world. Now, the whole 'wish-granting store' bit has been done time and again, both in Japanese works and in American ones -- once more, not to say that XxX Holic doesn't do it well - it does - I' just saying it ain't the first time it's been done.

I'm not saying either show is an exact carbon copy of something that's been done before - that's not what cliche is. Both plots draw from things that have been done before and combine them. DNAngel I think does it terribly, while XxXHolic got the magic touch of CLAMP.

Now, what I was implying in my post is that you do not by any means have a 'weird taste in manga,' because if it was weird there wouldn't be so many people who read it, and there are a TON of people who read both. I wasn't trying to insult you - yeah I was probably quite a bit condecending, but that's just me being an *** XD[/COLOR]

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[COLOR=Indigo][quote name='2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange']DNAngel is VERY cliche. It is made up of four general plotpoints. 1.) a romance story, but you said it has nothing to do with it, so I'll leave that out. 2.) A kid who tranforms into an older guy, which has been done before (if you want, I could go find some examples) 3.) the whole 'master theif' thing, which I think was pulled off terribly since the heists are probably the most boring part of the story. and 4.) a love triangle/square/pantagon/whatever shape you feel describes it. I can't see anything unique about it.[/COLOR][/quote]Are you talking about the anime or the manga here? Since there's a world of difference between the two. The manga is quite a bit better than the show and has yet to even finish. If you're talking about cliched, in my opinion the actual show is far more into that role than the manga is. Which by the way is far from boring and does have some unique qualities to it. :p

Even the romance as you put it is a bit different since in the anime only Diasuke [spoiler]has a sacred maiden where in the manga both of them do. [/spoiler]

How about you actually get those examples you are talking about? Since done before doesn't necessarily mean cliched. Also, the 'master thief' bit isn't the main story here, the issues due to Krad/Dark [spoiler] being from the same dark art is.[/spoiler][quote name='2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange'] I wasn't trying to insult you - yeah I was probably quite a bit condecending, but that's just me being an *** XD[/COLOR][/quote]If you don't want to insult people, quite being so abrasive and calling things 'boring' or 'cliched' based on your personal opinion. And stop being an *** as you put it. :p It's not necessary to respond to someone's post just to make assumptions about what they think that aren't correct. Nor is it necessary to announce, oh by the way, what you like is cliched and boring. Which is what you sounded like in that post of yours. [/COLOR]

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[QUOTE=indifference][COLOR=Indigo]Are you talking about the anime or the manga here? Since there's a world of difference between the two. The manga is quite a bit better than the show and has yet to even finish. If you're talking about cliched, in my opinion the actual show is far more into that role than the manga is. Which by the way is far from boring and does have some unique qualities to it. :p

Even the romance as you put it is a bit different since in the anime only Diasuke [spoiler]has a sacred maiden where in the manga both of them do. [/spoiler]

How about you actually get those examples you are talking about? Since done before doesn't necessarily mean cliched. Also, the 'master thief' bit isn't the main story here, the issues due to Krad/Dark [spoiler] being from the same dark art is.[/spoiler]If you don't want to insult people, quite being so abrasive and calling things 'boring' or 'cliched' based on your personal opinion. And stop being an *** as you put it. :p It's not necessary to respond to someone's post just to make assumptions about what they think that aren't correct. Nor is it necessary to announce, oh by the way, what you like is cliched and boring. Which is what you sounded like in that post of yours. [/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[COLOR=DarkOrange]As said before, I was only responding to the idea that she had a weird taste in manga in my first post. I will be the first to admit that I am often an elitist prick when it comes to anime and manga -- hell I have made a passtime out of calling people 'Narutards' and laughing at them to their face.

But in my first post, the only remark I made was that XxX Holic was good - it just didn't supercede cliche. That's not even outright calling it cliche. But if you try to say that they aren't cliche at all, I'm going to testify against it, because I find both series to be fairly cliche.

As for DNAngel, I will admit my only experience with it was volume one of the manga, which I bought around a year and a half ago. Everyone was giving it all these reccommendations, and I decided to check it out. I thought it was boring, not funny, the heist scenes sucked, the love story was unrealistic and cliche, the characters were uninteresting, and that it was all-around double plus ungood, plus it never really got anywhere. It had it's first plot twist before it had even become interesting, and I couldn't bring myself to care enough to look at volume two.

As for XxX Holic, I've read the first 4 which my friend let me borrow, and I thought it was really good, and I plan on buying it at some point.[/COLOR]

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[COLOR=Indigo][quote name='2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange'] As for DNAngel, I will admit my only experience with it was volume one of the manga, which I bought around a year and a half ago. Everyone was giving it all these reccommendations, and I decided to check it out. I thought it was boring, not funny, the heist scenes sucked, the love story was unrealistic and cliche, the characters were uninteresting, and that it was all-around double plus ungood, plus it never really got anywhere. It had it's first plot twist before it had even become interesting, and I couldn't bring myself to care enough to look at volume two.[/COLOR][/quote]My experiance is from reading through volumes 1-10. And recommendations are only good if it's the type of series you like after all. lol There's plenty of well liked manga's that I find boring, like Naruto or Bleach. I hate action manga since I prefer to see it animated instead of reading it. But that's personal preference, not an indication that the manga is bad. And cliched? Again, it's pretty damn hard to find something that isn't cliched and even then, done before still doesn't mean boring or uninteresting.

If you don't like it, it certainly isn't going to bother me any. Or rather it won't change my opinion of liking it. Since your take on it is still your opinion and not an indication of whether or not it really is as bad as you portray it to be. ;)[/COLOR]

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[QUOTE=indifference][COLOR=Indigo]My experiance is from reading through volumes 1-10. And recommendations are only good if it's the type of series you like after all. lol There's plenty of well liked manga's that I find boring, like Naruto or Bleach. I hate action manga since I prefer to see it animated instead of reading it. But that's personal preference, not an indication that the manga is bad. And cliched? Again, it's pretty damn hard to find something that isn't cliched and even then, done before still doesn't mean boring or uninteresting.

If you don't like it, it certainly isn't going to bother me any. Or rather it won't change my opinion of liking it. Since your take on it is still your opinion and not an indication of whether or not it really is as bad as you portray it to be. ;)[/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[COLOR=DarkOrange]I feel the same way, and yes, it's true that it is near impossible to not be cliche thee days -- which is why i was saying that being cliche isn't a bad thing. Just because something is good doesn't mean it isn't cliche, and that's the point i'm arguing - and it's an arguement I've been in plenty of times, though I'm glad that you are the first who understands what I mean.

And yeah, it's true that something being reccommended doesn't matter, but my friends at the time were really into that kind of thing, and back then I was looking for nothing but romance stories and Naruto - that was basically it. I'm willing to admit, I used to be a huge Naruto fan, I have more volumes of Naruto than anything else (11). back then, cliche didn't matter to me, and I still hated DNAngel, though that's against the point.

how popular or how original something is has nothing to do with wether you like it or not. If you like nothing but CLAMP and Shounen Jump manga, for instance, that's your own perogitive (sp?) but at least admit that you aren't 'weird' for liking them. THAT's the part that set me off.[/COLOR]

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[quote name='MistressRoxie][color=#9933ff][size=1]I have really weird taste in manga. [/size][/color][/QUOTE][COLOR=Indigo][QUOTE=2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange']how popular or how original something is has nothing to do with wether you like it or not. If you like nothing but CLAMP and Shounen Jump manga, for instance, that's your own perogitive (sp?) but at least admit that you aren't 'weird' for liking them. THAT's the part that set me off.[/COLOR][/quote]She was saying that her taste was weird and depending on what she normally likes that may be true you know. ;) I think you read to much into that statement. Since for all you know, her tastes may be completely different so for her those manga may be weird because it's not what she normally likes.

There's also the factors of what's popular among one's friends or the area they live in, etc. So if you consistently like stuff that others don't it's going to seem weird to you even if it isn't. The question of whether or not it really is weird is irrelevant if you think about it. Where I live, there are quite a few people who think anyone who likes anime in any form is weird and a pervert, a sex offender as well as a delinquent who needs a life. It doesn't make it true though. lol [/COLOR]

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[QUOTE=indifference][COLOR=Indigo]She was saying that her taste was weird and depending on what she normally likes that may be true you know. ;) I think you read to much into that statement. Since for all you know, her tastes may be completely different so for her those manga may be weird because it's not what she normally likes.

There's also the factors of what's popular among one's friends or the area they live in, etc. So if you consistently like stuff that others don't it's going to seem weird to you even if it isn't. The question of whether or not it really is weird is irrelevant if you think about it. Where I live, there are quite a few people who think anyone who likes anime in any form is weird and a pervert, a sex offender as well as a delinquent who needs a life. It doesn't make it true though. lol [/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[COLOR=DarkOrange]Ah yes, I can see this, and that's exactly [i]why[/i] i made that post, in an attempt to be informative. That's why i said to spend more time on the internet -- here you can find out exactly what is popular, and what is well-received, and you will learn about more series so that you can identify that a series is cliche. The reason for the post to begin with was that i was under the impression that she really did think her taste was weird, and that she didn't know that the manga was cliche, and so i was saying 'hey, check it out, you've got stuff to learn.' I may not have worded it very well, for that I apologize. I didn't mean to be offensive, but it's in my nature I guess XD.

As for your alternate explanation for the word 'weird' being used, i guess i can see that. It isn't a way I would use the word, but then I speak in terrible broken English XD[/COLOR]

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[quote="As from Dictionary.com"]cli·ché /kliˈʃeɪ, klɪ-/
?noun
1. a trite, stereotyped expression; a sentence or phrase, usually expressing a popular or common thought or idea, that has lost originality, ingenuity, and impact by long overuse, as sadder but wiser, or strong as an ox.
2. (in art, literature, drama, etc.) a trite or hackneyed plot, character development, use of color, musical expression, etc.
3. anything that has become trite or commonplace through overuse.
4. British Printing.
a. a stereotype or electrotype plate.
b. a reproduction made in a like manner.
?adjective
5. trite; hackneyed; stereotyped; clichéd.[/quote][quote="As from Merriam Webster Online Dictionary"]cli·ché
Variant(s): also cli·che /klE-'shA, 'klE-", kli-'/
Function: noun
1 : a trite phrase or expression; also : the idea expressed by it
2 : a hackneyed theme, characterization, or situation
3 : something (as a menu item) that has become overly familiar or commonplace[/quote][color=#9933ff]The key part of these definitions are the words "trite," and "hackneyed."

I'm again going to refute your idea that xxxholic and DNAngel are "cliche" based on the dictionary definition of these words. I don't know how you can even say DNAngel and xxxHolic are "trite" or "hackneyed." Furthermore, the point is, as indifference said, "done before doesn't necessarily mean cliched." For instance, just because DNAngel has a romance doesn't make it cliched. Romance is in EVERYTHING. Romance doesn't even qualify as a cliche, just because then every single piece of literature ever written, way back to Shakespeare and the like would have to be considered "cliche."

Additionally, I, too, would love to see the examples you can cite for me in which the themes from DNAngel are seen in other manga.

[quote name='"2007DigitalBoy"][color=Darkorange']If you like nothing but CLAMP and Shounen Jump manga, for instance, that's your own perogitive (sp?) but at least admit that you aren't 'weird' for liking them. THAT's the part that set me off.[/color][/quote][QUOTE=indifference][COLOR=Indigo]She was saying that her taste was weird and depending on what she normally likes that may be true you know. ;) I think you read to much into that statement. Since for all you know, her tastes may be completely different so for her those manga may be weird because it's not what she normally likes.

There's also the factors of what's popular among one's friends or the area they live in, etc. So if you consistently like stuff that others don't it's going to seem weird to you even if it isn't. The question of whether or not it really is weird is irrelevant if you think about it. Where I live, there are quite a few people who think anyone who likes anime in any form is weird and a pervert, a sex offender as well as a delinquent who needs a life. It doesn't make it true though. lol [/COLOR][/QUOTE] indifference says it very well, I think. You don't even know me and so all you can see is that I've read A (singular) CLAMP series and like it, and SOMEHOW that disqualifies me for being 'weird.' I said my taste in manga was weird for a reason, because to me, it is. Personally, I think it's strange to be able to hop from a manga like xxxHolic to say, Saiyuki or Only the Ring Finger Knows. The plot of those manga are completely and entirely different from each other. I also believe that liking xxxholic was weird because it's the one manga that I like and the friends I've lent it to did [i]not[/i] like it.

[quote name='2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange]Ah yes, I can see this, and that's exactly [i]why[/i'] i made that post, in an attempt to be informative. That's why i said to spend more time on the internet -- here you can find out exactly what is popular, and what is well-received, and you will learn about more series so that you can identify that a series is cliche. The reason for the post to begin with was that i was under the impression that she really did think her taste was weird, and that she didn't know that the manga was cliche, and so i was saying 'hey, check it out, you've got stuff to learn.' I may not have worded it very well, for that I apologize. I didn't mean to be offensive, but it's in my nature I guess XD. [/COLOR][/quote] By the way, I spend massive amounts of time on the internet, and frankly, I [i]still[/i] felt my taste in manga was weird. There are far too few sites about xxxHolic as compared to a lot of other manga and anime.

Additionally, spending a lot of time online and "identifying a cliche" have nothing to do with each other, and everything to do with understanding the definition of a cliche. I don't need to know about the plot of every manga ever created to know if something is "trite" or "hackneyed." I think I've had enough life experience, literature classes in the past ten years (3rd grade - 12th), and ability to use a dictionary to know when something is cliche or not. I don't need the internet to tell met that. And in anycase, why would you go to other online sources and take their word for it, when it is much more important to reach the truth yourself? I think it is apropos to quote a speech that I wrote, which won me second place in a national competition:

"What will we [b]do[/b] when we hear someone's ideas, thoughts, or opinions? Will we [i]wordlessly agree[/i] with them? Will we look at the people around us and respond however [b]they[/b] are responding? [b]Anybody[/b] can do that, but they are still being average. In order to [i][b]rise[/b][/i] above the state of being mediocre, it is important to [i]question[/i] these ideas, [b]evaluate[/b] their validity, and determine for.our.selves whether they are im[b]por[/b]tant ideas or not."

I don't need the validation from the anime and manga community to determine whether or not something is cliche. And humbly, I would like to say that I don't need your validation either.


P.S.: Props to Lumi (see post somewhere below mine). Lova ya dear! Thank you! *huggles*
P.P.S.: (I think it's apparent I'm having a "Chris White" moment. *giggles*)[/color]

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[quote name='2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange']If you think reading CLAMP manga like XxXHolic or reading DNAgel makes you unique and crazy, you are sadly extrmely mistaken and need to spend more time on the internet. Believe me, if it's being released in America, it's more than likely pretty popular, and if it's got the CLAMP STAMP then you can bet everyone and their grandma has read it, lol.[/COLOR][/quote]

[color=darkred]First of all, my grandmother does not read manga. She thinks it is the devil's work :devil:.

Like Roxie said earlier, she never said or even alluded to the fact that she is unique and crazy (and being her best friend in real life, I can confirm that that is true.) Also, being an avid reader of manga, I have only ever read and owned one series by CLAMP, Legal Drug. I find it funny that you think everyone reads CLAMP. QAlso, while some manga may appear incredibly popular in Japan, I have read a few that I cannot find anyone else who has read said manga. For example, Demon City Shinjuku. It never leaves the shelf at Borders.

And lastly, I don't think I know anyone who spends more time on the internet than Roxie (except me, but that doesn't count because she at least sleeps an hour or two a night). If she were to spend as much time at an internet cafe as she does at home, she would be poor in about two weeks (even with a steady income). I own more manga and anime than she does, but she knows more about each and every series than I do. She is addicted to the internet. We went on a trip to Hawaii, and the one thing she hated about it was that she could not get on the internet. We have another trip to Italy coming up. A whole two weeks without the internet. I have no idea how she is going to survive. Considering some of your other posts, I think [i]you[/i] need some more quality time with the internet.[/color]

[quote name='2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange']DNAngel is VERY cliche. It is made up of four general plotpoints. 1.) a romance story, but you said it has nothing to do with it, so I'll leave that out. 2.) A kid who tranforms into an older guy, which has been done before (if you want, I could go find some examples) 3.) the whole 'master theif' thing, which I think was pulled off terribly since the heists are probably the most boring part of the story. and 4.) a love triangle/square/pantagon/whatever shape you feel describes it. I can't see anything unique about it.[/COLOR][/quote]

[color=darkred]... O_o I don't even know what to say to this. [i]Do you actually read manga?[/i] Well, following your general plot point list:

1. A romance story: I have yet to see a manga, book, movie, anime, song, play, or anything (except newspaper articles) that does not have "love" in it somewhere. Heck, even rap songs have love and sex in them. The theme may not be as obvious in some things, but it's there. After all, all you need is love. This should not even count in your list toward what [i]you[/i] think is a cliche because if it was counted, then EVERYTHING IS CLICHE (just like everything can give you cancer).

2. Kid turns into older man: Okay, please provide examples. I need to see these. And no, Mythical Detective Loki Ragnarok does not count because he gets younger, not the other way around. But you know, the fact that you have to go [i]find[/i] these examples make it pretty obvious that these stories are not as common as you seem to think think. Okay, he turns into an older guy, but he does it to rob museums and it [i]prevents[/i] him from getting the girl, which is not normally how it works. The only thing I can think of where a kid gets older is the movie "Big". I think DNAngel is alot different from the whole "magical fortune-telling/wish-granting machine making someone big" plotline.

3. Master Thief: Huh? Can you give me another example where a kid comes from a long line of [i]hereditary[/i] theives? I also believe the heists are the best part. Maybe not up to "Italian Job" standards, but hey, this is a kid robbing museums. I personally am disappointed there is not enough concentration on what Dark's actually there for. They need more heists, but they are not boring. I still don't understand why you think this is a general plot point.

4. Love Triangle/Square/Pentagon/Whatever: See point 1.[/color]

[quote name='Luminaire][color=darkred]1. A romance story: I have yet to see a manga, book, movie, anime, song, play, or anything (except newspaper articles) that does not have "love" in it somewhere. Heck, even rap songs have love and sex in them. The theme may not be as obvious in some things, but it's there. After all, all you need is love. This should not even count in your list toward what [i]you[/i'] think is a cliche because if it was counted, then EVERYTHING IS CLICHE (just like everything can give you cancer).[/color][/quote]

[quote name='2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange']Now, what I was implying in my post is that you do not by any means have a 'weird taste in manga,' because if it was weird there wouldn't be so many people who read it, and there are a TON of people who read both.[/COLOR][/quote]

[color=darkred]Being Roxie's manga librarian, I would have to say I think her tastes are a little strange. I don't like xxxHolic, for my own reasons and opinions that I don't care to share. But when Roxie calls me and tells me she finished reading volume 7 and then asks me to bring her "Whistle!" the next day, I think her tastes are a little strange. We are going from Supernatural to Soccer. And then she'll call me and ask for "X-Day". Now we are going from Soccer to "Let's Blow Up the School". Let's not even go into "Gravitation". Maybe "weird" is not the right word to describe her interest in xxxHolic and DNAngel, but I believe the genre variety and order in which she reads them, could be called a little strange. But that would also make my interest variety strange.[/color]

[quote name='2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange'] I wasn't trying to insult you - yeah I was probably quite a bit condecending, but that's just me being an *** XD[/COLOR][/quote]

[color=darkred]Well, if you had to write this and make excuses, you obviously should not have posted in the first place. This topic was created for people to share their interests in different varieties of manga and maybe interest other people in new series. We are not here to criticize what people like and enjoy doing in their spare time. Being an "***" does not give you the right to criticize and upset other people. In the future, if you feel you are going to be an ***, [b][i]KEEP IT TO YOURSELF[/b][/i].[/color]


[Color=royalblue]Now that I have gotten that off my chest, I will tell you all my own interests.

I am a big fan of angst and action. My favorite series is Saiyuki (and Saiyuki Reload). I enjoy some sports manga like "Whistle!" and "Prince of Tennis". I love stories with lots of character development and a good romance from time to time. I am also an avid reader of yaoi manga. "Only the Ring Finger Knows" is probably my favorite love story of all time (yeah, it even beat Shakespeare and I love Shakespeare). I enjoy Sci-fi and supernatural stories as well. I pretty much buy what I like, so here is what I own:

Saiyuki, Prince of Tennis, Whistle!, Chronicles of the Cursed Sword, Brain Powered, Passion, Little Butterfly, La Esperanca, Only the Ring Finger Knows, Gravitation, Fushigi Yuugi, X-Day, Ragnarok, Kill Me Kiss Me, Legal Drug, Beyond My Touch, LoveHolic, FAKE, Cantarella, Fruits Basket, Descendants of Darkness, Demon City Shinjuku, Heat Guy J, Godchild, Demon Diary, Loveless, Candidate for Goddess, DNAngel, Gundam Seed, Eerie Queerie, Samurai Deeper Kyo, Gundam Wing: Blind Target, Gundam Wing: Ground Zero, Getbackers, Juvenile Orion, Angel Sanctuary, and Cross.

I hope that's everything. We're moving so I packed some of my manga already.

~Luminaire ^_^[/color]

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[COLOR=DarkOrange]First of all, I don't even know what the words 'trite' or 'hackeneyed' mean. Secondly, i don't think cliche is something that calls 'opinion' into action - cliche is 'fact'. There is no debate over wether something is cliche - if it's been done a bunch of times than it is cliche. More specifically, most would define cliche as something that has been done before better, and in that case it would be an opnion, but I think my, like, 8 freaking posts have made it obvious that that isn't how I think of the word cliche.

Second, is it just be, or are you ignoring what I'm saying and crawling up your own ***? I'm not [i]suggesting[/i] that a lot of people read [B]XxXHolic [/B] and [B]DNAngel[/B], I'm [i]telling[/i] you and the fact that you still want to say tat not so many people read them [i]proves my point.[/i] Just looking around this very sight you can see that it's true! We have a DNAngel and XxXHolic thread right here on these boards! both of which have a significant number of replies considering the size of these boards.

I can go to a bigger site and look at a couple hundred people's lists of their favorite shows and at least 10-20% of the replies will have one or both of these shows on their list. I know there are other people who read XxXHolic because I borrowed the volumes I read from a kid in my Japanese class. I know of other people who have probably read it, and I damn sure know some people who have read DNAngel (i think i know someone who talked about cosplaying as a character, i can't remember -- I tend to tune them out when they start on about nekocon.) When you consider that there's probably plenty of people who I don't know who go to my school that read manga, since I doubt I've spoken to more than 1/20 of the kids at my school.

That's only one school, and when you consider how many schools ther are in America, the chances of there being more than a handful where absolutely no one has read XxXHolic or DNAngel is frighteningly small. In the internet world, both series are immensely popular - especially beacuse of CLAMP's influence, and the countless DNAngel yaoi fanfiction. The fact that both series have been produced in America to a major extent is further evidence of this fact. It's downright foolish to think of either series as indie in the manga world.

As for your wanting examples of other similar anime, let me reach into my magic bag. Now remember kiddies, we're talking about elements here. As I said before, there's no such thing as a story with the exact same thing as another unless it's a remake, but as far as the elements of the story go...

1. [B]Ranma 1/2[/B] - Ah, [B]Rumiko Takahashi's [/B] classic. Let's see... like DNAngel, the main character undergoes a transformation - in this case from male to female, that causes him problems. Now, it's not the exact same as having 2 people in you, but it has a similar effect on the story. Both implement romance and comedy together, using action as a sort of minor factory to drive the story along. Both involve complex love... shapes (too many lines >_<) that revolve around the forms of their transformation. (i.e. certain people love girl ranma, others guy ranma, just like Daisuke and Dark's dilemma.)

in this case, Ranma does a much better job of all elements. It's funnier, the romance is more realistic, and the action scenes aren't a completely boring waste of time, though that's all just my opinion.

2. While the story is nothing like DNAngel in the slightest, [B]King of Bandits jing [/B] does have a theif with the same implcations. Jing is supposedly able to steal absolutely anything, even your heart. As the series progresses, we find out that Jing's mom was apparently a master theif as well, and when you consider his youth despite massive reputation, we can easily assume that his craft has been passed down through the generations. i.e. a hereditary theifdom.

Those two alone cover everything I said, so that just goes to show that off the top of my head I can pull two series that have similar plot-points, not to mention that I enjoy either of them far more, lol.

[quote name='MistressRoxie']"What will we do when we hear someone's ideas, thoughts, or opinions? Will we wordlessly agree with them? Will we look at the people around us and respond however they are responding? Anybody can do that, but they are still being average. In order to rise above the state of being mediocre, it is important to question these ideas, evaluate their validity, and determine for.our.selves whether they are important ideas or not."[/quote]

A. What the hell does that have to do with anything? and B. Exactly how are you perceiving the things I'm saying to you?! I'm not trying to melt your freaking brain, there's a difference between advice and command.

EDIT: Oh, one last thing

[quote name='Luminaire']Being an "***" does not give you the right to criticize and upset other people. In the future, if you feel you are going to be an ***, KEEP IT TO YOURSELF.[/quote]

**** you.[/COLOR]

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[COLOR=Indigo][quote name='2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange']in this case, Ranma does a much better job of all elements. It's funnier, the romance is more realistic, and the action scenes aren't a completely boring waste of time, though that's all just my opinion.[/COLOR][/quote]Try saying this after you've read more than the first volume since forming an opinion on less than 10% of a series isn't really accurate. Saying Ranma does it better is meaningless since you yourself have already admitted that you only read the first volume of DNAngel. How can you say the romance and action scenes are boring when you haven't even read most of them? You've read volume one, well come back and talk [I]after[/I] you've also read 2-10.

Also...This applies to all of you. Leave out the direct attacks towards each other. I don't want to see any more of stuff like this: [quote name='Luminaire][color=darkred] We are not here to criticize what people like and enjoy doing in their spare time. Being an "***" does not give you the right to criticize and upset other people. In the future, if you feel you are going to be an ***, [b][i]KEEP IT TO YOURSELF[/b][/i].[/color][/QUOTE]Or this:[QUOTE=2007DigitalBoy][COLOR=DarkOrange']**** you.[/COLOR][/quote]Censored or not, there's no reason for it. Up until know it's been heated but fairly civilized. So lets keep it that way. [/COLOR]

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[quote name='indifference][COLOR=Indigo]Try saying this after you've read more than the first volume since forming an opinion on less than 10% of a series isn't really accurate. Saying Ranma does it better is meaningless since you yourself have already admitted that you only read the first volume of DNAngel. How can you say the romance and action scenes are boring when you haven't even read most of them? You've read volume one, well come back and talk [I]after[/I'] you've also read 2-10. [/COLOR][/quote]

[COLOR=DarkOrange]I've only read volume 1 of Ranma 1/2 as well, so they're really tied in that respect. I've always meant to buy volume 2 of Ranma, but I never got around to it. And in any event, I think it's time I dropped out of this arguement, for the sole reason that I have no desire to read any more of DNAngel XD[/COLOR]

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[quote name='Babybits2002']Well, I would have to say.......edge of my seat and jam packed full of action. :catgirl:[/quote]i look for manga that is like a good book that makes you want to read more and more , and still never get bored[color=seagreen] reading it over and over again .:love: :love: :love: :love: [/color]

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I like to see original plotlines, likeable characters, edge-of-your-seat action, emotionally charged epic battles, zany humor, stong positive themes (Such as never give up, stand up for your beliefs, fight for your dreams, protect the innocent, stuff like that,) adventure, and powerful storytelling. Good artwork also helps, as does few fanservice moments (they're more distracting than erotic in some series, anyway.)

Originality is getting harder to come by, though. It's a shame. DBZ was very original for its era, but now every action manga has some form of hyperbolic time chamber somewhere.

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[quote name='kaekara']Do you prefer a manga that is a bunch of comedy and makes you laugh all the time? Or do you like a manga that makes you sit on the edge of your seat that is jam packed full of action? Or maybe you like a manga that is full of drama and sadness? Or maybe there are some other things you like when reading a manga?[/quote]


Like others said, something NEW. Teher are too many harems and school-based manga, you grow to expect certain cliches. In every school-based manga I've read there is some form of sports day or cook off or love competition blah blah.

Personally I like fantasy's that are completely new and different with an engaging plot with loads of unexpected twists and characters with their own deep backgrounds and personas, not stereotyped things there for a purpose but with no apparent life whatsoever.

I think manga's a lot like a writen novel: just with pictures and dialogue insted of description. Thus they should be treated as such.

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