What the astronauts of Apollo 11 REALLY found on the moon....

[Guest Matt]

[color=red][b]I believe we went to the moon, but if the government came out one day and said we really didn't, I wouldn't be surprised. They lie and cheat so much, that anything that say may be a lie.[/b][/color]

[Juu]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Son Goten [/i]
[B][color=red][b]I believe we went to the moon, but if the government came out one day and said we really didn't, I wouldn't be surprised. They lie and cheat so much, that anything that say may be a lie.[/b][/color] [/B][/QUOTE]

I agree with you on that comepletely.
But.... if the skeleton was from earth, what country got there before the US did?

[wrist cutter]

'No basis in fact' you say, James? As I recall, most all of it was based on fact (like the shadows thing posted already).

You bring up good points on how it's probably just a "silly paranoia" - but there are also good points on how it could be true, and there are strong people on either side (as you have shown us). It's not really fair to call it complete idiocy.

Yes, chances are good we really did land on the moon, for the reasons you said. But all the things pointed out make it seem like an impossibility - it makes sense to be open to more ideas on the topic, if you ask me.

I won't say we definitely didn't land on the moon, but I also won't say otherwise.

Why is it we haven't been on the moon since 1969, anyway? What with technology improving, you'd think it'd be getting easier every day.

[Fall]

As far-fetched as this whole thing may seem, some things even more far-fetched could happen.

Last Friday an asteroid came close to hitting Earth, and surprisingly enough, every asteroid detecter in the world missed it, and it wasn't picked up until it was over New Mexico. They've named it "2002MN".Acording to astronomers, if it hit the energy release would have been that of a large nuclear weapon. It came within 120,000 miles of Earth. That mightn't sound very close, but it is in "space" terms....here's the newspaper article for proof. :) (Sorry about the big picture, I couldn't put it as an attachment as it was too big in size) [i]Source: The Daily Telegraph (Sydney newspaper).[/i]

[img]http://members.lycos.co.uk/ssfx/scan_asterroid.gif[/img]

Now that's hard to believe.....that's why I don't exactly find this skeleton on the moon thing hard to believe.....I man, anything can/could happen....:rolleyes:

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by wrist cutter [/i]
[B]'No basis in fact' you say, James? As I recall, most all of it was based on fact (like the shadows thing posted already).[/quote][/b]

[color=royalblue]The "shadows thing" was not based on fact. It is [i]exactly[/i] like the "man on mars" thing. Someone looks at the image and draws something from it, others say "yeah, I see it too!!!!" and so on. To say that the moon landing didn't happen is so laughable that it's almost unbelieveable.[/color][quote][b]

You bring up good points on how it's probably just a "silly paranoia" - but there are also good points on how it could be true, and there are strong people on either side (as you have shown us). It's not really fair to call it complete idiocy.[/quote][/b]

[color=royalblue]Incorrect. There are absolutely [i]zero[/i] factual points relating to it simply "not happening". It's ludicrous and it's completely fair to call it complete idiocy. There are only so many issues where I can say "Yeah, you have a point" or whatever. This is not one of them. This is honestly the stuff that religious cultism is made of.[/color][quote][b]

Yes, chances are good we really did land on the moon, for the reasons you said. But all the things pointed out make it seem like an impossibility - it makes sense to be open to more ideas on the topic, if you ask me.[/quote][/b]

[color=royalblue]Of course we landed on the moon. It's very easy, if you know relatively little about space technology (or the moon landing itself) to say that it "seems like an impossibility".

And that is one thing that annoys me about it. People who are 100% unqualified listen to quack "scientists" and believe every piece of garbage they say about the moon landing never happening, yet these same people refuse to listen to the overwhelming evidence and information from [i]qualified[/i] and experienced science on the very same issue.

It is absolutely mind blowing that there could even be a question about this issue. As I said, if I were an astronaut and I were reading this, I'd be pretty pissed that a few lay individuals can dismiss a piece of history as easily as picking their nose. It's just mindblowing.[/color][quote][b]

I won't say we definitely didn't land on the moon, but I also won't say otherwise.

Why is it we haven't been on the moon since 1969, anyway? What with technology improving, you'd think it'd be getting easier every day. [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=royalblue]Because the trip to the moon was merely an issue of "can we or can't we". We have had absolutely no need to travel to the moon since then -- most of NASA's technology and finances have been used for satellite technology and research that would lead eventually to man landing on Mars.

I guess that, when we eventually land on Mars, you won't believe that either? :rolleyes:

Ugh, I probably shouldn't keep posting here...there is no way I can change the mind of ANY people who would actually [i]believe[/i] something so utterly foolish.[/color]

[wrist cutter]

You respond to me as though I am saying "WE ABSOLUTELY DID NOT LAND ON THE MOON."

No, multiple shadows = multiple light sources is fact. You can't deny that more than one shadow means there is more than one light source, that is a fact.

Did you even watch the damn show?

Again, you say things as though I am putting my foot DOWN, we did NOT land on the moon. Personally, I lean towards we did land on the moon, for the reasons you suggested and the fact I don't think our government would scam us into such a thing. I'm just saying that there are things that make me a suspicious.

That last, sarcastic sentence is what makes me mad. I'm not Fox Mulder - I don't even believe in aliens or most paranormal things. I don't believe the government is out to "get us" or that we are being watched or anything. I am just slightly suspicious about this one event in history, for reasons I believe to be somewhat valid. Again - if someone asked me, do you believe we landed on the moon, my response would be "Yes, though I am a bit suspicious".

What you fail to realize is that you're just as stubborn as everyone else here. You can't change our minds; but nobody is able to change yours, either.

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by wrist cutter [/i]
[B]
No, multiple shadows = multiple light sources is fact. You can't deny that more than one shadow means there is more than one light source, that is a fact. [/quote][/b]

[color=royalblue]So one light source cannot create multiple shadows? What on earth do you think happens with sunlight hitting earth? That argument is moot.[/color][quote][b]



That last, sarcastic sentence is what makes me mad. I'm not Fox Mulder - I don't even believe in aliens or most paranormal things. I don't believe the government is out to "get us" or that we are being watched or anything. I am just slightly suspicious about this one event in history, for reasons I believe to be somewhat valid. Again - if someone asked me, do you believe we landed on the moon, my response would be "Yes, though I am a bit suspicious".

What you fail to realize is that you're just as stubborn as everyone else here. You can't change our minds; but nobody is able to change yours, either. [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=royalblue]And what you fail to realize, is that my comments were not entirely directed at you. I was referring specifically to those who believe, as a statement of fact, that the moon landing didn't happen.

I am well aware of your stance on the issue. And hell yes, I'm incredibly stubborn on this issue -- just as I'm stubborn when I say that the sky is blue and that the Earth is round.[/color]

[wrist cutter]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by James [/i]
[B]
I am well aware of your stance on the issue. And hell yes, I'm incredibly stubborn on this issue -- just as I'm stubborn when I say that the sky is blue and that the Earth is round.[/B][/QUOTE]

And see, this is why most people don't debate with you.

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by wrist cutter [/i]
[B]

And see, this is why most people don't debate with you. [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=royalblue]I'm quite happy to debate issues. The thing is, I obviously get passionate about an issue where someone is debating an objectively foolish point of view.

Now, I know that you are an intelligent person and so, I know that within reason, if you see evidence and arguments that you find to be logical...you are going to be more likely to see another angle on the whole discussion.

Sometimes I debate with people and I see their point of view...and that changes my own conclusion.

So I am not generally stubborn about [i]everything[/i] (people who actually know me can attest to that), but I [i]am[/i] stubborn when I'm trying to defend common logic (in this case, maintain a level head when there is even the suggestion of something foolish).

So in that sense, I think most people can understand why I'm stubborn on some issues.[/color]

[Schrat]

I recently talked to my Earth Science teacher on this subject and she said that these people dont knwo what they are talking about.

The flag blowing in space..... well there is wind in space.

The man on mars, just a SHADOW!

I would love to believe some of this, and most of it i do believ, aliens, area 51, and stuf but some stuf I have to just disgard.

***What 9/11 rumors are u speaking of?***

[Valen]

Yes, but we were in a race with Russia's space exploration to get a man on the moon. NASA wanted to win that, Nixon wanted to win that. So there's enough evidence to lead me to believe that NASA, as much as I love em, did cheat in the moon thing. Russia at the time had not seen what the surface of the moon looked like at the time, so NASA used this to their advantage.

Yea, there is wind space, it's called solar wind. Created by the erupting flames on the sun being thrown into space.

[quote]
[i]Originally posted by James[/i]
[b]So I am not generally stubborn about everything (people who actually know me can attest to that), but I am stubborn when I'm trying to defend common logic (in this case, maintain a level head when there is even the suggestion of something foolish).
[/b][/quote]

Well, somethin you should know James... LOGIC KILLS!

[Anna]

Oh for the love of Pete, some people are so frickin gullible.

Who's to say those skeleton/bare foot photos weren't fake themselves? The setting of the moon is really easy to recreate I bet..... grey and black.... and oh, what's this? A skeleton? Ooh, how about we get a giant sandbox, get some poor-quality film and make footprints with our bare feet and say that the US government has been lying to their public for all these years because HEY those pictures are really from the moon! Psh...... please, I [i]highly[/i] doubt all that Chinese gibberish is true.....

And on the topic of recreating scenes on the moon, I think it's [i]possible[/i] that the tape was fake. I in no way doubt that astronauts have been to the moon, though. I dinno, maybe they actually did make a tape up there but it got messed up, so they made a new one. ^_^ I don't know, I don't really care either. I say we've been to the moon because there's more evidence than just tape footage. It's not like it's impossible or anything. But hey, if you're the type to eat up whatever bizarre thing you hear that raises up a ruckus, be my guest... look like a fool....

[Corey]

James, your mind is just too closed. Your not willing to accept any new ideas. You [i]say[/i] that your conclusion might change when you hear another side of the argument but through all the dabates I've seen you participate in on the Boards you have always stuck with your orginal opinion on a certain topic. I am willing to hear any idea. I am pulled between both ideas on the Moon Landing topic. I really like to believe the idea that we landed on the moon and have the flag there and everything, but it may also be logical that we never even got there. How do we know that the shuttle did nothing but orbit the Earth when it blasted off? We don't. How do we know that those pictures are for real? We don't. Every single thing about the Moon Landing could have been faked. On the other hand, the whole thing could have been real. No one is going to know for sure untill the Governments of the world become completely truthful with their people. Since we all know that that is never going to happen, I guess that we will never know for sure.

[James]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by DarkOrderKnight [/i]
[B]James, your mind is just too closed. Your not willing to accept any new ideas. You [i]say[/i] that your conclusion might change when you hear another side of the argument but through all the dabates I've seen you participate in on the Boards you have always stuck with your orginal opinion on a certain topic. [/quote][/b]

[color=royalblue]Actually, my mind is really open.

But you see, I'm not a very gullible person. It's not a matter of being unwilling to accept new ideas, it's an issue of being able to accept the ideas that hold some credence.

When someone posts something about the moon landing not being true, of [i]course[/i] I'm going to take a hard line. Just the same as if someone told me that they had fairies in their garden.

I'm always willing to accept new ideas, on the condition that those ideas are factually true. If you follow this conspiracy theory through to its natural conclusion, you can see that we are entering a place where we really shouldn't be -- silly, pointless paranoia.[/color][quote][b]

I am willing to hear any idea. [/quote][/b]

[color=royalblue]As am I. :)

I'm willing to [i]hear[/i] an idea. Even if it's completely airy-fairy. Doesn't mean I'll necessarily be gullible enough to believe [i]anything[/i] I'm told.[/color][quote][b]

How do we know that the shuttle did nothing but orbit the Earth when it blasted off? We don't. How do we know that those pictures are for real? We don't. Every single thing about the Moon Landing could have been faked. On the other hand, the whole thing could have been real. No one is going to know for sure untill the Governments of the world become completely truthful with their people. Since we all know that that is never going to happen, I guess that we will never know for sure. [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=royalblue]And this is the kind of attitude that I personally think is totally nonconstructive.

What reason could the various Goverments involved have for lying to us? I mean, do you possibly understand how paranoid this concept is?

I could go on and on about the [i]ample[/i] proof of the moon landing, but what's the point? I mean, honestly. If you're going to be gullible enough to believe some insane conspiracy theory, then there isn't much hope for you.[/color]

[Heaven's Cloud]

[color=indigo] I can understand the skepticism about the moonlanding, I can even understand the reasoning behid the US wanting to "fake" a moonlanding. But I would think that our knowledge of outerspace has grown enough that any "false moonlanding" woud have been uncovered long ago by rival space programs.[/color]

[Corey]

I admit you do make a good point James.
However, the fairies in my garden give me things so I can't tell them I don't believe in them.
:)

[Juu]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Anna [/i]
[B]Oh for the love of Pete, some people are so frickin gullible.

Who's to say those skeleton/bare foot photos weren't fake themselves? The setting of the moon is really easy to recreate I bet..... grey and black.... and oh, what's this? A skeleton? Ooh, how about we get a giant sandbox, get some poor-quality film and make footprints with our bare feet and say that the US government has been lying to their public for all these years because HEY those pictures are really from the moon! Psh...... please, I [i]highly[/i] doubt all that Chinese gibberish is true.....

And on the topic of recreating scenes on the moon, I think it's [i]possible[/i] that the tape was fake. I in no way doubt that astronauts have been to the moon, though. I dinno, maybe they actually did make a tape up there but it got messed up, so they made a new one. ^_^ I don't know, I don't really care either. I say we've been to the moon because there's more evidence than
just tape footage. It's not like it's impossible or anything. But hey, if you're the type to eat up whatever bizarre thing you hear that raises up a ruckus, be my guest... look like a fool.... [/B][/QUOTE]


LOL, yeah, that could be true, but it takes all the fun out of thinking, what's out there?

[Fall]

Ok....well this topic was meant for people to say what they thought on it, not to complain how fake it is.....if you don't believe it, just say so, no need for an argument as I can see starting here.

[BlackOutlaw]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by James [/i]
[B][color=royalblue]Erm, of course this is not true. And neither is the "moon landing conspiracy" which frankly, only ignorant people believe.[/color] [/B][/QUOTE]
Ok, I may be ignorant. But tell me this, how can a flag wave with on a planet with no air. If you answer me that, I will stand right next to you on this issue.

[Jesus Chicken]

Well I honestly don't know...
The footprints on the Moon, could be the result of some horrible disaster, explosion, some guys foot, hit the moon. As unlikely as it seems anything is possible.
As Anna said, the whole thing could be faked, anything could be going on. Some kids, might have been messing around at home, and taking photos and such, ect.
I'm not saying don't believe in it, but I don't know, it's up to you to make your own chioce, ultimatly, and this is mine:
I don't know.
I think that all anyone wants is answers, but god knows, it's highly unlikely we will ever get the answer we want, true or false.

[Fall]

That's true, I doubt we'll ever get an answer any time soon. But as I said before, it's 50/50 for me. Anything could have made those footprints.....though I think the skeleton thing is a bit far-fetched.

We've never really explored anywhere except for the Moon in outer-space, and I don't think we've got a big enough knowledge of space yet. I think that anything could happen out there, maybe even stuff that's never happened on Earth before. That's half the reason I think it's true.

Though then again, there's other points that suggest it's not true.

[Char!]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by DarkOrderKnight [/i]
[B]I admit you do make a good point James.
However, the fairies in my garden give me things so I can't tell them I don't believe in them.
:) [/B][/QUOTE]

[color=teal][size=1]lol! Man, you rule...

Anyway... To [/color][/size][color=royalblue][size=2]James:[/color][/size][color=teal][size=1] I too think that people who support complete rubbish don't have a whole lot of hope. You say that the very [i]suspicion[/i] of Apollo 11 being a hoax is rubbish.

But consider this: A few years before Apollo 11 "landed," many people, many intelligent, well-spoken people considered ever landing on the moon complete rubbish. Plus, the Soviet Union and the US were fiercly competing for who would get there first.

Is it not even [i]possible[/i] that just maybe, just [i]maybe[/i] the US tricked us all to claim the moon first? Isn't there even the [i]slightest[/i] possibility of doubt in your mind? I think that anyone who is so closed-minded that they can't answer yes to those questions is beyond help.

Yeah, that's about it for now.[/color][/size]:babble:

[Valen]

Yes, that is very true. It was called the Great Space Race or something of the matter, was it not? And practiacally saying there is no chance in hell that there is life out there anywhere in the universe makes you seem like the ignorant one, but if its wht you believe, then stand by it and don't go calling other people ignorant when NONE of it has been proven, not even your beliefs... I'm not directing this to anyone, but if it applies to you, then so be it.

Now, let's all have a nice day.

[Schrat]

I agree totally with you Valen, Dont scream and whine that someone is totally insane if it [i] cound[/i] happen, maybe there is life out there.....maybe...

[Jesus Chicken]

If you ask me, I don't think that there is any question as to if there is life out there. I just think the question is when, and where will we find it?